Jackie Earle Haley and Jonathan Steinberg Talk Human Target
" Jackie Earle Haley is certainly on the comeback trail in the film world. After his Oscar-nominated turn in Little Children, his first film in 13 years, Haley appeared as the legendary Rorschach in Watchmen and also has roles in two high-profile films out later this year, Martin Scorcese's Shutter Island and the remake of A Nightmare on Elm Street, where Haley portrays another legendary character: Freddy Krueger. Even with all this newfound work in film, Haley has still managed to find time for the small screen, as he appears as Guerrero in the new Fox series Human Target, which will air tonight, January 26 on a special date and time at 9 PM ET on Fox, due to the President's State of the Union Address on Wednesday. Next week, the show falls into its regular time period on Wednesday nights at 8 PM ET. Haley recently held a conference call, along with executive producer Jonathan E. Steinberg, to discuss this new series. Here's what they both had to say.
Jonathan, what turned you on to this DC Comic book property for this series?
Jonathan E. Steinberg: It was pitched to me, actually, It's a property that had been in development, in both TV and in movies, for awhile, and I think for good reason. It's a very enticing idea, a guy who, for whatever it says about his character, is always willing to get in trouble for you, to become you, to get you out of the trouble you've made for yourself. I think everybody had tried to find a way to make it work. It had been pitched to me by Peter Johnson as something that he and Warner Bros. were looking to do. From there, it was too good of an opportunity to do an action show like that, with the opportunity to be anywhere in the world, in any given story.
Are there any clients that he wouldn't take on? If a Madoff approached him, would he turn him down?
Jonathan E. Steinberg: We've played it early on that there's some hurdle you need to clear to gain his interest or get him to the point where he's willing to take a case for you. I don't think that means that he wouldn't necessarily take a case of somebody that he didn't necessarily agree with or sympathize with, but I think you definitely make your case to him when you ask for his help.
Jackie, what was it that turned you onto this role of Guerrero in the show?
Jackie Earle Haley: John came to me and I read the script and I just thought it was kick-ass. I thought it was a lot of fun. I liked that it comic-book related, that it was real light in tone, that it was this really cool action-hero character and the character of Guerrero supporting that character, I just thought what a well-written character. It just seemed like a lot of fun and I loved the idea of getting in there and working with these guys on a long-term basis and working on one specific character, as opposed to what you do in a movie. You do it and you're done. This is an ongoing process and that's kind of neat.
Jackie, we've seen two episodes so far and your character is still a little bit of a mystery. How much do you know about your character and how would you describe him?
Jackie Earle Haley: How much do I know about the character? That's what's fun about this guy, it seems like we're kind of all learning it together. Obviously, we've done more shows than what you've seen, but this guy is - it still seems like I'm getting more - I'm just coming up with more questions for him than we are with answers. But I think as each week starts to go along, we start to, I think, add a little bit more of Chance's background and the fact that there is some event in his past that was quite a pivotal event that kind of caused Chance to kind of go from one side to another, and I think Guerrero was a part of that. That holds a lot of interest for me; I definitely know that Guerrero has worked on the dark side of things and now he's working on the more righteous side of things with Chance, but what's neat about Guerrero is you never really quite know where his loyalties lie. It's really fun riding that line with the writers and stuff. It's just - I don't think we want to get to those answers real quick; I think it's fun kind of exploring the multi-dimensionality of this guy, and seeing where it leads and who he is - what makes him tick.
And did you kind of create your own back story about where he was when the show started, or how he got to be this hired gun?
Jackie Earle Haley: No, we've been working on that together.
You alluded to a little bit before, but coming off doing mostly movies, what else has been different for you about doing a TV series from an acting standpoint, or just a logistical standpoint? What is it like doing a TV series versus being in the movies?
Jackie Earle Haley: Let's see, it's a much faster process, although these guys are really doing a heck of a job technically. I mean these things look like little movies; it's amazing what you can do on TV now. I think the biggest difference is in the development of the character. So often you kind of get a screen play and then you can work with the directors and the writers really kind of learning and developing who this guy is, what his back story is, what kind of brought him to this point, and then you dive in and you do the work and you're done. This one is kind of - it's that and then the reverse of that as well. It's like you try to figure out so much before you're shooting what you're shooting, but so much of the development and the answers come later. It's a different process because it's like a - I guess instead of making one two-hour movie, hopefully we're making 100 one-hour movies.
As a perpetually nervous actor, when you were starting to get really good roles after Little Children, like Watchmen, when a TV show came your way, did you see that as a great long-term opportunity or was it just another chance you'd take or what?
Jackie Earle Haley: It definitely was cause for pause to think about it. Especially with the movie thing kind of tracking so well and suddenly the notion of doing a television series, I had to really kind of consider the medium. It had been so long since I've dealt with any of these issues, the last time I looked at this stuff it was like the early '80s, and I think since then that the lines between television and movies have blurred quite a bit. I particularly love the whole HD 16x9 aspect of television and the 5.1 sound; it seems like we've got little movie theaters in our living rooms now. So it just really seemed kind of like this cool opportunity. Everything's probably a risk no matter how you look at it, every choice that you make, but it just seemed like such a fun show, it was comic-based and I love that, I had such a great time on Watchmen. But it just really seemed like a neat character and a wonderful opportunity, especially if this thing becomes a wonderful hit. It would be just a great show to work on episode after episode and to see what it's like to work as an actor on such a demanding, ongoing basis, and also to get to develop Guerrero and to see that character become even a more integral part of what's going on in Chance's back story, in his curve. It's pretty exciting.
Jackie, most people haven't had this perspective of being a star and then being away from it for quite a while, and then being back in it again. Tell me how does it feel different to you this time; how is your life different, and how does your approach or anything else about it feel different than it did the first time?
Jackie Earle Haley: I think probably the biggest difference is my age and perhaps I bring a little bit more maturity to it, meaning this is - I probably kind of took it for granted when I was a kid. I definitely was in love with the craft as a youngster, but I probably didn't fully understand it and fully get the depth of it. I think I appreciate that more now and I think that all of those fears and insecurities that I was joking about - I think being a little bit older and more mature helps to temper that a bit more than it was when I was 20.
So far Guerrero has been very much a character who operates from his intelligence, but this being an action series I'm wondering if he's going to get a chance to mix it up a little bit physically or get into some action scenes with Mark and fight that way.
Jackie Earle Haley: That's a good question.
Jonathan Steinberg: I would say, without giving anything away, there's a lot more to Guerrero than you see yet. I will leave it at that but there's some really fun stuff we have planned for the end of the season with him, and I think that where you met him as a guy who is - you're not quite sure what he's capable of; I think he's capable of quite a bit more than you've seen.
Jackie Earle Haley: Just wait until you see the master juggling episode.
Jonathan Steinberg: Right, exactly.
Jackie Earle Haley: I'm really excited about that.
Jonathan Steinberg: Buzz saws and torches.
How long - where are you in filming and how long do you think you'll be there before a break? And, are you going to attend those Winter Olympics?
Jackie Earle Haley: Wow. Let's see, we are getting ready to start episode 109. Do you know when we wrap?
Jonathan Steinberg: Yes, we are scheduled currently to wrap in the first week in March.
Jackie Earle Haley: Oh, okay. And I really, right now I'm staring out my window at these beautiful Olympic rings out in the middle of the bay, the Burrard Inlet, and that's about as close as I want to get to any event for the Olympics. I kind of like to avoid crowds, so I'm thinking Olympics are going to look great on my HD TV here in my living room.
Jonathan, I was hoping maybe you could tell us, what were some of perhaps the biggest production challenges getting the series off the ground, and maybe shooting the first couple of episodes?
Jonathan Steinberg: It's a great big show and it's a show that can't lean on a lot of the short cuts that some other shows that have done big action have been able to. We don't spend a lot of time on our sets. I think it was important to us, especially early on, that these stories start hot, and that we start well into the story. And so, there are any one of a number of challenges that go into trying to make something that feels like an action movie in eight days, where the next one starts the very next, in terms of production. I think there's a really good reason why nobody does this on TV and nobody has for a long time. When we started talking about it, that was what was really attractive to us about it, is that it hasn't really been done ever, and certainly not in a long time. I think it took us a little while to realize the harsh reality of why that is. But I think the show looks pretty good considering the challenges we've been through; it looks pretty good, I think, notwithstanding those challenges. I think we're getting better at it and we're learning how to do more with what we have and to do more with less. I think it's - there's no story reason why you can't tell this kind of a story on TV, I think it's just about trying to figure out how to make it work. So hopefully we're getting there.
Jackie, I had a question for you, what's with all these DC properties in your resume? You did Watchmen, you're doing Human Target, and then I just went, "Oh, he's angry Leonard." How do you keep getting involved with all of these?
Jackie Earle Haley: I purchased some stock in the DC Universe. I don't know; I guess I got some good buddies over at DC. It's just - it's awesome; DC materials rock. Yes, some of it's - I can't even say, it's not coincidence. I guess the DC guys kind of thought of me for this after Watchmen. DC comics are awesome. After Watchmen, I really started to kind of get into the comic book world; I'm still nowhere near quite the fan that some of the fan boys are, but after reading Watchmen, I kind of went on an Alan Moore jag as well as reading a few others, and I'm still poking around through some comics.
You've really been able to kind of create really interesting full-bodied characters with some very dark characters - characters that always have very either morally questionable backgrounds or with what you've done with the last few films that you've been in, and of course, this character - we still don't know his whole story. What attracted you in particular; I mean I know you're particular what projects you take and those seem to be a running theme with what you've chosen. What about that kind of conflicting character's particularly attractive for you to explore?
Jackie Earle Haley: I think part of it's a function of - you know, you do a few pieces of work and then people kind of like to gravitate toward similar type characters. So what I've been doing is trying to kind of find diversity within those type of characters. There's definitely something very interesting to me about troubled souls and unhinged and characters like that. But at the same time, I - again, I try to find the differences between.... There's definitely similarities to characters like Ronnie or Rorschach or Freddy, or Guerrero, but yet there's huge differences in the approach and demeanor, and how these guys are, what they're about. So that's kind of what I look for; stuff that I can kind of sink my teeth into and find some diversity in.
I'm just wondering as the series goes on, are we going to get more background on the characters week-to-week, or might you just focus more on one character one week, one character the next. And, Jackie, are you invested more in the back story now or are you just kind of happy to let it ride week-to-week for the time being?
Jackie Earle Haley: I'll jump in real quick first. Yes, I think that to us from the very beginning, the back story of these three guys was important, and not just as a mystery for its own sake, but it defines where they came from and their shared experience defines their relationships now. I think that was interesting to us was that they all share this one traumatic, but also sort of very big kind of mythic experience between the three of them. It was interesting to us to see how that rippled through their relationships currently. I think before the end of this season, you're going to learn a lot more about them and a lot more about that event.
I was wondering how you balance sort of Guerrero's darker nature with the sort of lighter action feel of the show. This could be for either of you to answer if you have some insight. And also, as a DC geek, I would suggest looking into Dispecter and Jim Corrigan as another property. Jackie, you would be a great Jim Corrigan.
Jackie Earle Haley: Well, cool; I'm all over it. I can't really speak to the performance issue but I think it is always a balancing act for all three characters, especially for Guerrero, that the show needs to be fun; it needs to feel like an adventure in the truest sense of the word, and I think part of what that means is not just that it's light, but that there's something hankering it underneath - that there's some gravitons to it. I think that's a large part of what - in some ways I think Guerrero is right at ground zero of that tight rope that we try to walk every week; and it's being able to have one foot in both worlds.
Jonathan Steinberg: Yes, that's what I kind of find with Guerrero that's kind of interesting; if he's kind of in this piece that definitely has this fun kind of tongue in cheek tone from the '80's and like I said earlier, Mark Valley is just nailing that and Chi McBride is brilliant at playing Winston. And Guerrero is kind of fun because I think he definitely kind of has a little foot in that world in the sense that he kind of plays the straight guy for Chi and stuff. But I think he's an interesting addition to that tone that there is this unhinged character that is - his background is a little bit questionable, his morality, his ethics. It is kind of neat how he brings this little darker tone to this otherwise light tone. I think it's an interesting balancing act that the writer guys are just - I think they're nailing it.
Your last big role - well one of your biggest roles so far since you returned has been - was behind a mask for most of the movie. And upcoming you've got Freddy where you've got makeup on for most of the film. Is it good to be acting with your own face or does wearing a mask sometimes, or makeup, help you really embody a character.
Jackie Earle Haley: Wow. Wearing the mask for Rorschach definitely helped to embody the character. Wearing the makeup for Freddy was grueling. It was so arduous and uncomfortable. It was a great experience but at the same time, it was pretty harrowing in terms of the makeup. But, yes, I would take all of that uncomfortable feeling and hand it off to the character between action and cut. We were doing some re-shoots over the Christmas holidays and I have to tell you, in the middle of doing those re-shoots, I started to miss Guerrero. I really did; it's like getting into makeup for Guerrero versus getting into makeup for Freddy is like night and day. It made Guerrero just seem all that much more pleasant.
Jonathan Steinberg: That's when we abandoned this fire Guerrero goes through for season two.
I was just curious what maybe some of the most more notable guest stars you might be able to see in the next week or two?
Jonathan Steinberg: Who are we seeing in the next week or two? This coming week - Emanuelle Vaugier is our big guest star, who's a lot of fun, and is hopefully going to be a part of kind of an ongoing relationship that I think you'll kind of see teased at the end of the episode that airs this Tuesday night. Who is after that? There's a fun cameo - not really a cameo - fun, it's a smaller role, but it was a lot of fun for us. The episode that airs I think two weeks after that that was a little bit - I don't want to ruin it but we're all big X Files fan here so there's an actor who played a big role in that show who we were able to get and come play a fun role for us in an episode called Run that I think airs in two weeks. So there's a lot of fun coming down the pipe, and I think after that, there's - actually this following week, there's another Mitch Pileggi and Autumn Reeser came on to do a show, and Kevin Wiseman from Alias, who's great, and who is just so much fun. So there's some good stuff coming down the pike.
Jackie, which of your own personal character traits did you inject into Guerrero's DNA?
Jackie Earle Haley: Which of my own personal character traits? Dude, right. I mean that just kind of came out when we were shooting and then the guys embraced it. I guess I kind of say dude every other word. That's so embarrassing. I hate that I admitted that so scratch that. No, absolutely nothing. The long hair - that's what it was; it was the long hair. It was my own personal character trait that I had maybe 30 years ago. Alright, that's it.
You can catch Jackie Earle Haley as Guerrero in Human Target which airs on a special date and time tonight, January 26 at 9 PM ET on Fox. You can catch the show at its regular date and time on Wednesday, February 3 at 8 PM ET on Fox.